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Age of Mythology Heaven » Forums » Strategy and General Discussion » Deadly's Thought of the Day 3
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Topic Subject:Deadly's Thought of the Day 3
deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 04:43 PM EDT (US)         
Topic : Rushing

I failed miserably at playing AOE . I used to be good, until people started rushing. I could never beat my friend to Bronze, where he then attacked me and killed me with Knights/Camels(ROR). I would practice for ever, but could never beat the Assyrians. Rushes suck, and are a cheap way to win. They also make the game way less fun. I want to be able to have the defences AOK has. Even tho rushes are still possible, they are more meaningful and easier to stop. ES wants to eliminate the Rush to get to the next age. But How? The next age has far more superior unit, buildings, techs, and God Attacks. I hear the defences are gonna gonna be weaker.
Please share you thoughts. I don't want to hear that "ES will make it fun", b/c thats no real answer.
This isn't a poll either, please talk about what you think about rushing, if you thought AOE was rushed filled, and b/c of what reason, and suggest how we could elliminate that problem.


The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.

[This message has been edited by deadlydentures (edited 10-15-2001 @ 04:43 PM).]

AuthorReplies:
Clarissimus
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 05:18 PM EDT (US)     1 / 20       
I know how you feel. I, too, used to play AoK without ever rushing. I won almost every game in which no one rushed me, but I lost almost every time someone did. I started to really hate rushing.

But then I did something radical. I tried it myself. I discovered that rushing is really fun!

So I say don't knock it 'till you try it.

Last_Knight
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 05:20 PM EDT (US)     2 / 20       
My suggestion: ES should make "anti-rush" map types:
maps that look like mazes, where it takes you long time to get to your enemy. Maybe agressive animals (like wolves) in the way can help also.


The Last Knight
Grasshoppers are cheap, nutritious, tasety,Kosher and easy to dissect
deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 05:20 PM EDT (US)     3 / 20       
I have, and i usually win in AOK
But its not as fun. People die to fast. No big battles.

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 05:21 PM EDT (US)     4 / 20       
LK, very good idea!! i didn't think of that!!

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
SoR_Anarchy
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 05:25 PM EDT (US)     5 / 20       
Rushing is a part of RTS games, just gotta live with it.

God Bless America.

I am the state.

deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 06:12 PM EDT (US)     6 / 20       
Its a part of an RTS game that sucks!
I personally want to see large empires duke it out.

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
Last_Knight
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 06:19 PM EDT (US)     7 / 20       
Do/did you play Heroes of Might&Magic games?
There you can build maps that cat like "mazes", with neutral ("gaia") guides in the way. If you fight them to early (with a relatively weak rush army), they will make you a serious damage, but if you don't rush, and bring a strong late-game army, you'd beat them easily. Maybe it will work in AoM.


The Last Knight
Grasshoppers are cheap, nutritious, tasety,Kosher and easy to dissect
SoR_Anarchy
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 06:29 PM EDT (US)     8 / 20       
Rushing will always be a strategy in RTS games. I'm sure AoM will be like AoK:TC, in the sense that you can make settings that won't make rushing that affective. Of course the opposite is true too.

God Bless America.

I am the state.

Uluzah
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 06:57 PM EDT (US)     9 / 20       
I have a couple solutions that may or may not work.

1) Make huge maps - maps that take a very long time to travel across so if a person does rush, their army won't get there crucially early to totally wipe a person out, but early enough to affect that person's economy and to slow him/her down.

2) Make rough terrian - terrain that can't be moved through at the units normal speed. The terrain can slow the speed of the units down, making the attack on the enemy later than it normally would be with normal terrain. This, again, would give the opponent more time to build up, and the attack won't knock him/her out, but would slow him/her down. A possible terrain for this is mud, marsh, or shallows.

Good? Bad? Maybe?


Never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 07:01 PM EDT (US)     10 / 20       
Quicksand!

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
ArrangedEarth
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 07:14 PM EDT (US)     11 / 20       
Most already know my opinion on this...

A . R . R . A . N . G . E . D . E . A . R . T . H
Uluzah
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 07:33 PM EDT (US)     12 / 20       
What is your opinion? I just started looking at these forums. I used to read the AoKH forums all the time. Then, a weird time in my life came...

It's still not clear, but it involved Diablo 2, and LoD. Me playing it, and only it. No more AoK/TC. Ahhhh, it's all coming back to me now... I quit AoK/TC. Diablo in my sad mind was better - more fun to play. Argh, stupid me.

Anyways, my old forum names were, I think: Jesse & _Jesse_. But, don't worry, I don't think I'll leave again. AoM has grabbed my attention, and put a straight(sp?) jacket on it, and I'm no Hoodinee(sp?).


Never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 07:37 PM EDT (US)     13 / 20       
Hi Uluzah,
My name is DeadlyDentures, and I run these here forums

*gets banned*
ahhhh


The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
IV1066
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 07:41 PM EDT (US)     14 / 20       
Quote:
Make huge maps

We know these will exist, there will have to be a map big enough for 16 players. That's pretty huge. As to getting rid of rushing, I think ES should do the opposite. Encourage it by allowing us to quickly create fun armies. Most people, imo, dislike rushing not because the game ends so fast, but because most of the fighting is with 1 or 2 military units, towers, and villies, as opposed to massive Imp. age battles with siege, 5-6 unit types, stuff like that. If ES allows us to build up real armies really quick, people probably won't mind. I wouldn't anyway.

deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 07:43 PM EDT (US)     15 / 20       
Quote:
Most people, imo, dislike rushing not because the game ends so fast, but because most of the fighting is with 1 or 2 military units, towers, and villies, as opposed to massive Imp. age battles with siege, 5-6 unit types, stuff like that

Bingo, thats exactly why i hate Rushing

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
Uluzah
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 07:45 PM EDT (US)     16 / 20       
I see what you're saying. I dislike rushing for both of those reasons though I think people still won't build armies early, because it will slow down their economy. It could save them from defeat, but people still won't do it, IMO.

Never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
Alexandergreat3
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 08:10 PM EDT (US)     17 / 20       
Hey guys =), I know exactly what you're talking about. However, I don't agree 100%.

Quoted from DeadlyDentures:
I could never beat my friend to Bronze, where he then attacked me and killed me with Knights/Camels(ROR). I would practice for ever, but could never beat the Assyrians.

Did you use Assyrians, too? Or did you use some other civs? Some civs have really fast starts (like chinese in AoK), therefore, if you pick a slower civs (like Byzantines), you just can't advance faster than the other guy... simply because of his civs is supposed to be faster.

If you and your friend picked the same civs, and he still beats you by rushing, then it would make sense that you can beat him too (assuming that you two are at the same skill level)... by rushing him before he rushes you.


- Al


deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 08:19 PM EDT (US)     18 / 20       
My friend and i have this mutual agreement that we never play with the same civs. We call our civs, and that what we always play with. No one can play with another of our civs. If you wanted to change you could, but you had to choose a civ noone else played. It doesn't bother me that much. In AOC, hes the Mayans, and i'm the Spanish. My brother is the Koreans. ect. ect.

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
Alexandergreat3
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 08:34 PM EDT (US)     19 / 20       
Mayans have a much faster start than Spanish, so it wouldn't be a surprise if the Mayans player reaches Feudal age first and start rushing the Spanish. Chinese, Mongols, and Huns are good choice against Mayans, if you want to defend from the rush.

If you pick the Byzatines (considered one of the worst civs, if not THE WORST civs in AoK:tc), then you just have little chance against Mayans. Therefore, it just comes down to picking the right civs to play with. If you just want to have fun, then go for the civs you like (obviously). If you play because you just want to win, then go for the best civs (back in AoK, the Chinese is the best civs in 1v1 arabia.).

Sometimes you get lucky that the civs you like happens to be the best civs .

deadlydentures
Mortal
posted 15 October 2001 09:04 PM EDT (US)     20 / 20       
My friend does advance quick, but he has yet to beat me in AOC!!!!

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference.
The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference.
The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference.
And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.
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