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Age of Mythology Heaven » Forums » Strategy and General Discussion » Is ISIS powerful than ZEUS ?
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Topic Subject:Is ISIS powerful than ZEUS ?
aliasgherman
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 02:36 AM EDT (US)         
Why does everyone say ISIS is overpowered. I am a beginner player and think that zeus is better that ISIS. Because Myrmedans are really great. Also with eqyptians the millitary units from barracks etc are very weak. Only Migdol Stronghold units are good. So you have to be on your toes for advancing to the heroic age ASAP. Please explain why ISIS is considered overpowered. Also why people choose Osiris over THOTH. Because THOTH gives book of thot which trains elephants almost instantly, which is good for combat. Eagerly waiting reply from ISIS players.
AuthorReplies:
Zmash
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 02:54 AM EDT (US)     1 / 16       
Why is isis op?
She can get oped ellies, that even beat their hard counters
more population, thats means more military or more caravans to spam mercs
0 pop mercs
ancesors/eclipse
cheaper upgrades
blocking monuments
Can get up a tc or a migdol in very few seconds thanks to pharaoh
She is op but still fun to use

Zeus in my opinion is also op, but he is very dificult to use
btw eggy's clasical units are great, you have to understand that they are hard counters (the best hard counters in the game in my opinion) and you cant hope that one slinger pwns one jarl

harr
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 05:30 AM EDT (US)     2 / 16       
Isis is mainly considered op because of how good she is at pulling off the fast heroic strategy. Many of the advantages Zmash listed work to help this.

Mercenaries can help protect you until you get to heroic. Cheaper upgrades mean that you can get the resource gathering upgrades at a lower cost, allowing you to get to heroic faster. Monuments will stop the enemy using god powers against you offensively taking away a good way of attacking. The towers get a free upgrade when you reach classical age - 4 free upgraded towers is very useful to protect you.

Once the Isis player gets to heroic they can use ancestors+eclipse - a free army from ancestors, which is considerably stengthened by eclipse. Egyptian heroic units are very strong. Elephants can in some circumstances beat their counters and when backed up by axemen... Chariot archers are very strong too and spearmen are enough to stop you worrying about cavalry. The extra pop slots allow you a bigger army and it is often pop which decides how strong an army you can get, not how many resources you have.

Quote:

Can get up a tc or a migdol in very few seconds thanks to pharaoh


An egyptian villager building while empowered is the same as a greek villager building.

[This message has been edited by harr (edited 12-11-2005 @ 05:31 AM).]

RudeGod
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 10:25 AM EDT (US)     3 / 16       
IMO the most OP thing about Isis is the GP-blocking mouments. This is really a killer in many circumstances. If you put up monuments in different areas of the map you can near enough prevent your opponent using any GP's at all. Isis need have no fear of the artemis earthquake with a strategically placed monument.

An example of Isis being OP - I'v played all civs, with norse and greek I was going up and down between 1600-1700. I've been playing with Isis now for only a few weeks and am already 1750+.

Zeus is not OP at all - a very balanced god. No early eco bonuses makes him quite weak early on so its only fair that myrmidons are tough to make things easier for zeus in the late game.

IceCreamDude
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 11:00 AM EDT (US)     4 / 16       
i wouldnt even compare zues to isis except mayb in mythic.

-Even more than the other eggies, isis is hard to attack and raid w/mercanries,towers/etc and non-hades greek is rather quite eZ to raid.
-Isis has more and better eco bonuses than zues. Isis can also go anubis to get necrosis (?)
-Using infantry as siege is rather difficult even with zues x1.5 bonus, siege will do better than any infantry could ever hope for
-Protection from god powers without requiring a certain god path = ownage
-A/E owns all esp. atties,


-Myrmidrons beat eles on a pop basis so thats a minor win for zues.

[This message has been edited by IceCreamDude (edited 12-11-2005 @ 11:01 AM).]

harr
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 11:45 AM EDT (US)     5 / 16       

Quote:

-Isis has more and better eco bonuses than zues.


Egyptian villagers gather slower to start off with though (even the pharoah only mean that you can gather one resources as fast, but even that resource isn't gathered faster).

Quote:

-Using infantry as siege is rather difficult even with zues x1.5 bonus, siege will do better than any infantry could ever hope for


Greek siege is better than egyptian siege. The zeus bonus just helps since you are going to attack buildings with infantry at some point. Plus you can't get siege in classical, but you can get hoplites in classical.
aliasgherman
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 01:16 PM EDT (US)     6 / 16       
Thanks for all the replies. I get the main point to be pop cost. But the same number of greek army will easily beat eqyptian army. Even hoplites are really good at that. I think that eqyptian petrobola are the best seige. But for greek myrmidian will do that easily. You said that eqyptians gather resources faster using Pharaoh. But eqyptians are slower already in building etc. Eqyptians get age advances etc at lower rates. But due to lower gathering rates they do suffer. Finally , I and my friend are players from Pakistan. We have seen here that greeks are preferred here too much. Maybe due to their stronger wariors. Also Myrms. are the best infantry only lagging behind Fanatic. Please have a reply of all these questions.
Also , someone said that he had 1600-1700 when he played with greek , but 1750+ with ISIS. My friend plays only with Zeus , and has a rating of 2150-2200. So this is not the criteria.
No one , said why take Osiris compared to Thot in Mythic. Thot can instantly train elephants. Also has the great Secrets of Thot from which villagers work faster.
Thankyou.
IceCreamDude
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 01:26 PM EDT (US)     7 / 16       
-they r 10% slower but u get more resouces. consider it a mini-husbanry sorta effect. Later in the game isis will have a stronger eco with 10% cheaper techs. Later u can get 2 ( or 3 inc. SoO ) pharoahs or if u went thoth u get the book of of thoth to increase production. Both Hades and Possy can get divine blood, zues cannot.

-Sphinx kills buildings in classical too.

-greek ranged siege does base 11 crush damage x 3 projectiles = 33 crush damage while eggy siege does 50 crush damage but costs 50 more wood. 50 wood sounds a fair tradeoff for 17 crush. greek ranged siege has also slightly less hp.

-greek short range siege does 17 base crush x 3 projectiles = 51 crush damage. eggy siege towers do 50 base crush so greek short range is a lil stronger. However greek short ranged siege costs 300 wood and 200 gold and 4 pop while siege towers cost 100 wood and 200 gold and 3 pop. while greek short ranged siege have hp and slightly more attack, they r not effective in comparison to eggy siege.

-YES AT SOME POINT I WILL USE HOPLITES TO ATTACK BUILDINGS but id rather use them in battle, i dont really c a lot of TC razing in classical...

Strider 1
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 04:36 PM EDT (US)     8 / 16       
I thought the short ranged Greek seige shot four projectiles.....

Still, you cannot underestimate the range of the short range Greek seige. IMO they are definetly more powerful than Eggy seige towers. And have you seen the amount of HP the Greek short range seige towers have? It's much larger than that of the Eggy seige tower.

This is how it goes for me:

Egyptian long range seige > Greek long range seige (but it is available in Heroic....)

Greek short range seige > Egyptian seige towers


~~ Strider s~~

There is a time for many words, and there is also a time for sleep. - Homer

IceCreamDude
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 04:41 PM EDT (US)     9 / 16       
it can take more damage but for its cost and pop its not very strong for what it dishes out go check in the aomh units guide.
Pug
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 05:27 PM EDT (US)     10 / 16       
I think the question is best answered that in non deathmatch games Isis is better, but in a Deathmatch type of game Zeus seems stronger.
Unome
Mortal
posted 11 December 2005 11:28 PM EDT (US)     11 / 16       
All Eggys for starters have light cheap easy to spam units and of course the free tower upgrade... This is hell for any rusher because of the towers... Then the monuments prevent deconstruct, carnivora, undermine and anything else that can help out gp wise... So they can gp you but you not them... There eco is much less expensive so they can not only spam units easier than you but there economy is much better too! Then there is the bonus pop which allows them more villies with less tc so they are superior in every angle! Thus Isis is OP

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regular_gonzalez
Mortal
posted 12 December 2005 12:28 PM EDT (US)     12 / 16       
I'm a full-time Ra player, and have just started messing around with Isis. Her main advantages:
1) More pop
2) God-power blocking monuments
3) Cheaper upgrades
4) Awesome archaic age power. By far the most important resource for Eggy is gold, and that's what Isis's archaic power gives you -- lots and lots of gold.
(5 - not an innate power, but Ancestors/Eclipse gives you an instant army that can fight off a big attack on your flank, take down an enemy town center, wipe out your enemy's military buildings ... basically, the equivalent of Earthquake, a Mythic age power, as soon as you hit Heroic)

With any two of the above, she would be impressive. With all 4, she is ridiculously powerful. In my ideal world, they'd take #1 or #3 and give it to Set, and give Isis the cheaper migdols that Set currently has. This would make Set better and knock Isis down to the level of the other two Eggy gods.

Of course, in a perfect world I'd also like to see Ancestors not be affected by Eclipse (but perhaps be a little bit stronger than they are now, non-Eclipsed). This would make Isis a bit more manageable in Heroic, and also make her more flexible -- there would be compelling reasons to choose gods other than Bast/Nepthys.

I'd also like to see Archaic powers shifted a bit. Ra would get Vision, Isis would get Rain, and Set would get Prosperity. This makes more sense too, considering the gods. Ra is the chief Egyptian god, looking down from above ... therefore he can see things that normally can not be seen. Isis is the "mother goddess", the goddess of life. Providing food should be a natural. And Set is the god of death and the underworld. Gold is retrieved from underground.

If the above changes were made, Eggy would still be very strong but would have a much better balance among the three gods.

[This message has been edited by regular_gonzalez (edited 12-12-2005 @ 12:30 PM).]

cowfan28
Mortal
posted 12 December 2005 12:43 PM EDT (US)     13 / 16       
okay say ur playin zeus against isis:

isis get cheaper eco upgrades. he eco owns ur by the time u guys are in classical. but she stops makin villagers and ur eco gets stronger till urs is better than hers. all of the sudden she advances before u have an army cus u were too worried about ur economy. she finds ur base and casts ancestors + eclipse before u can cast ceasefire. and if this doesnt do it and some how u hang on. u build up an army, but u see she has about 10 elles wrecking everythin u got. if u hold them off shell advance to thoth and nail u with meteors. (even if u get lightning storm by then, its blocked by a monument)

AzianPhoenix
Mortal
posted 12 December 2005 09:57 PM EDT (US)     14 / 16       
Isis is very OP. I don't even go Ancestor/Eclipse. I go Bast/Hathor for those Rocs. I think ele roc drops are much more OP than Anc/Eclipse, plus the roc is useful all game. I usually use the Eclipse GP to block a threating GP at certain times or use it to boost my myth late game. Such as when I am transporting ele's in a Roc vs Zeus, it prevents them from bolting the Roc. Or I when I am attacking, it is a nice thing to make sure you don't get your army of spearmen turned into pigs, or have to deal with flaming ulfsarks, or have an underworld passage hit your econ while you are away, etc.

Best game ever made, don't dieeeeeeee
Brtnboarder495
Mortal
posted 13 December 2005 07:33 AM EDT (US)     15 / 16       
She's OP if you sit back and let her FH.

Gameranger: _NiGhThAwK_
a_game_a_win
Mortal
posted 13 December 2005 06:21 PM EDT (US)     16 / 16       
No, shes OP all the time
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