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Age of Mythology Heaven » Forums » Strategy and General Discussion » heroic Eggy help
Topic Subject:heroic Eggy help
posted 16 February 2010 12:05 PM EDT (US)         
I need help with eggy when it reaches heroic age. I'm a 1700-1750 Set player, and I always have trouble beating other eggy 1700+ players when were both in heroic age. I typically get out lamed and out played at this point of the game. I can win about 40% of games vs eggy but I need to improve my game.

I usually advance a 30 sec-1-2 min later than the opponent or go 2 tc adv cus i do priest rush/cf most of the time and get a very clear advantage by gaining map control and pushing him off hunt early. Yet i lose in heroic fights.
I HATE major laming (walls+cats,merc spam,tower spam etc) but sometimes i must vs eggy

My questions are
When i priest rush should my adv time be this late?

Also what units should i make when i reach heroic. Max on archers? Elephants? Miggy units+siege?

When should i go for another TC?

I want to take care of my enemy quickly cus ra/isis Heroic/Mythic are far better than Set's. Any tips on how?

Microing mercs? Any tips?
posted 16 February 2010 01:21 PM EDT (US)     1 / 7       
Don't play Set?

You could shift scarabs and rams into his base.
posted 16 February 2010 04:25 PM EDT (US)     2 / 7       
I don't think anyone knows. I'm sure the common belief is that Set is inferior and he's definitely the worst in eggy wars. Most eggy vs. eggy fights is Chariot Archer + Siege Tower(sometimes a couple spearmen?). Elephants only happen before Thoth if you're Ra and had a huge rain or something and you don't switch to wood in heroic, so you can pop like 8 elephants out on your empowered midgol. You'll probably have to develop your own play if you really want to accomplish something here. I wouldn't know where to start.

-shifting rams and scarabs
Yes! I remember someone having a siegetower/scarab shifting sands attack, probably with animals and villagers to build and a few mercs too. That may be the avenue to revisit to find an advantage over other eggy.
posted 16 February 2010 04:55 PM EDT (US)     3 / 7       
I think you are right in trying to end the game sooner rather than later. Versus Isis, I would always advance Sekmet so you can equal her in population. As mentioned, I think a scarab rush is also a good option.

I think you're main thing to do is to know where the second gold mine is going to be. If you can determine this then you can have your troops there and ready to thwart it. A+E shouldn't hurt you as much since you are already using priests but you'll also need to have some other troops in toe if you want to have a real chance of preventing the migdol. Figuring out where the second mine is should be easy for Set as well because of his uber scouting abilities. I played Set for a little while and I loved how I could have the entire map scouted (no black) before even reaching classical.

Your key to victory is not allowing the expansion to the second gold mine. I think you will have a much easier time with this versus Ra than Isis though.

Confucious says, "Man who jump through screen door likely to strain himself."
Bitten by a radioactive ostrich
posted 16 February 2010 06:01 PM EDT (US)     4 / 7       
posted 16 February 2010 07:03 PM EDT (US)     5 / 7       

oooooooooooooo oby's intuition

as for your army man, just spam all types of units

have a pretty diverse army
Mr Martel
posted 16 February 2010 08:16 PM EDT (US)     6 / 7       
Water maps are a completely different animal so I'm just going to focus on land maps as this is what it seems you are concerned more about anyways:

Closed low hunt Alfheim (yes, this has its own category) ->

A more economic style (Ptah always in Eggy wars as Set) but do as much damage to him as possible with your free MU, a few slings sometimes, and any priests you have made. Don't priest rush unless you can see he has really bad gold or only some forward hunt.

Open high hunt smaller to average size maps (Some Alfheims, Marsh, Savannah, Tundra, most Ghost Lakes) ->

Check for bad gold/forward hunt. If so, priest rush with a ~4.20 advance. If not, go 7:45 FH (make sure to push him off his forward hunt with animals + priest so he can't go Heroic off of this hunt) and leave only ~5 on food for vill production, the rest go on wood (the majority, usually 12 or more for this) and gold. Immediately put up a forward Migdol and Siege camp (empower one of these for faster production). It's best to build on his 2nd gold mine or a good central gold mine if you can't get it on his 2nd mine (especially vs Ra, vs Isis it is harder so just resign yourself to a good mine if you think you will have trouble getting your Mig up on his 2nd mine)

Vs Isis, remember ~6 (or more) priests for a/e (you have to use them a lot better if you only make 6, it's best to watch his score to know when he will advance so you can determine if he will use it early at your base or if he'll advance too late to use it in this manner so you know how many to make). Vs Ra, only make more than 3 priests if a. he priest rushes you, or b. he goes Bast (scarabs).

Pump CA and Siege Towers and BE AGGRESSIVE. Don't let them sit around, make sure they are nearly always doing something to pressure him. If you are vs Isis, and up with a lot of priests because of a priest rush, it's best if you have gone Neph as your ancestors can trigger him to use his a/e poorly. If not, go Sekhmet as Ram of the West Wind is super good and that free Scarab is a lot more useful than a Scorpion in Eggy wars.

Try to use Shifting Sands on either some vills of his in Classic or later in a fight you can a. shift vills away from your siege or b. shift some units to a back TC he may be grabbing that you have LOS on or c. any other necessary units he may have or d. save it until lategame as you can shift an unlimited amount of your own units and it is basically like Underworld Passage when the game goes late.

So yes, mass CA and Siege and if you had good hunt in Archaic/Classic and have excess food to throw in an Elephant (two if you can somehow afford it), do it as their mass HP and the likelihood your opponent will use his CA to target your Elephant instead of one of your Siege Towers is much higher so they do almost they same job as the Siege Tower in terms of damage dealt but also take some of the damage that would otherwise have been dealt to your CA. Not to mention vills don't get a bonus vs these

Just keep sending your Siege Towers forward (you want them to soak up as much CA damage as possible) and let his vills get mauled by CA when you pull them back. Just rinse and repeat. If he gets to the point where he is Mercing you, throwing up some towers around where your CA are firing from usually does the trick.

Never let him gather in remote areas unhindered. You should always be vigilant of him sneaking vills to a remote mine. Getting him off gold is the ultimate goal.

Watering Hole and larger closed Marshes (unless is the stupid waterless WH, then play like the above) ->

  • Play like the above maps anyways.
  • 2TC FH with Ptah farms where you play like Isis but you get Shaduf. You can still play aggressive with this but you make more Elephants and focus more on getting trade up as soon as Heroic and maintaining map control despite your 8:30+ up time (due to his up also being later). Often you can get a 4v2 TC vs other Eggy on these maps.
  • FM (not later than 10:30) through Thoth and be aggressive with your Meteor, CA, Catapults, and Intimidation (yes, intimidation, FMs have a built in intimidation factor vs pretty much everyone11).

    Final Thoughts:
  • Always try to steal as much of Ra's Rain as possible without too many farms stealing from your ability to make your strat work effectively.
  • Once past 10 min, you really shouldn't be putting many more vills on wood/gold and be focusing instead more on putting up farms, setting up trade, and other food costing enterprises.
  • Eggy wars that are stalemated through Heroic are often won by who can get Mythic in a good time for Catapults.
  • You must give up your "afraid to lame" mentality. This is not how Eggy is played. It is only Norse whiners that have labeled Mercs, Catapults, Rocs (not that these concern you as playing Set), Elephants, CA as lame (YES, THESE ARE THE UNITS THAT YOU SHOULD BE MAKING YET THEY ARE "LAME" TO THESE IDIOTS).

    Ok, upon review...I somehow did not include how to vs Vs Set is basically the same as Isis except you don't have to worry about a/e and these games often end faster with the aggressor's screen displaying "You Are Victorious". Just don't forget about his Shift which can really hurt you if he uses it well, and getting Mythic first in any mirror wars is often a huge indicator of who will win.

    Ok, just thought of this as well, I'll have to try it. Strat vs Ra on low hunt ->
  • If he is in a position where a Priest rush can really do damage you: First, Priest rush him and gain the advantage here. Second, instead of taking the extra 4-5 vills you have on gold (that you took off food while advancing) and putting them back on food for the faster Heroic time, you instead leave them on gold and put all new vills onto Ptah farms (buy Shaduf as soon as you can) and reap the huge reward of his Rain since you should have more farms than him due to his gold being pestered. Empower your TC while his Rain is going on and I believe you will be able to pump plenty of Elephants with your CA to give you a HUGE advantage in Heroic warfare.

    Now as I said, I just thought of this, so I will have to test it, but for the moment it sounds well in theory

    Good luck, hope this helps! Any more questions feel free to ask

    [This message has been edited by Mr Martel (edited 02-16-2010 @ 08:37 PM).]

  • NothingtoProve
    posted 17 February 2010 00:08 AM EDT (US)     7 / 7       
    Most of the strats you guys posted i have pretty much ingrained in my game. I know the importance of gold control, the basic eggy strats, gp usage, unit micro, and all that.

    I guess it's mostly the overall game that I need to improve like eco management/control (thanks Mr. Martel) . I watched some of my recs vs eggy and many of them are pretty even throughout the game. What kills me is usually the opp out wall/cat/merc's me. Also many times i see myself defending too much and letting my opponent determine the flow of the game.
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