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Age of Mythology Heaven » Forums » Strategy and General Discussion » Qestions for ES and a little suggestions.
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Topic Subject:Qestions for ES and a little suggestions.
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Bernardo
Mortal
posted 02 April 2002 03:24 PM EDT (US)         
First I want to say it's about AoM not it's X pack.


Question #1: Why did you make ships samller than they were originally?

Question #2: Why did you abandoned the idea of making units influential to ship's function?

Question #3: Will the population limit be larger than the one of AoK?


My Suggestions are:

1. Return to the original ships' idea. (If not do it in X pack).
2. Make at least a population limit of 250 or 300 please.


Well there are my questions and suggestions.


ISRAELISRAELISRAELISRAEL
ISRAELISRAELISRAEL
ISRAELISRAELISRAELISRAEL

AuthorReplies:
Bernardo
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 02:32 AM EDT (US)     1 / 34       
Oh come on any from ES answer....
izzy
Mortal
(id: Ballista_Turtle)
posted 03 April 2002 02:46 AM EDT (US)     2 / 34       

Quote:

2. Make at least a population limit of 250 or 300 please.

You do realise how horribly a game would lag if it had to handle 2400 fully rendered units?


Izzy|HG Angel |Since August 2000•~
INTL|HeavenGames•~
<(•'.'•)>
Socrates
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 03:41 AM EDT (US)     3 / 34       

Quote:

Question #1: Why did you make ships samller than they were originally?

Question #2: Why did you abandoned the idea of making units influential to ship's function?

"Anything that hurts gameplay will be blindfolded and shot." - Greg "DeathShrimp" Street

Psychic Ostrich
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 05:49 AM EDT (US)     4 / 34       
"and all the little bits left over will be trodden on, splased with acid, and used as fertilizer for a venus fly trap."

He said that as well, honest!

Yeah, the big ships didnt work in small streams apparantly, artistically, realitaly, and theoretically, or something...


SNIPPETS OF A CAFE CHAT:
Hey hi, damn, where is my... ...fridge, y'now, its been playing... ...with his nailclippers! I didnt know what to... ...weed, cos' i'm not a gardner, unlike Old... ...cushion, now it was... ...a bit soggy, with all his diarrhoea... ...experience with the theoretical side of... ...cats, oh they are doing... ...dancing with his best friend! now I would like to... ...grasp by the hilt you see? Anyway better be... ...going to lose his socks, silly... ...frog. Cya'...
Real
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 06:27 AM EDT (US)     5 / 34       
#2 Was only a rumour, never in I guess.

#2 Big ships stopped each other from swimming in lil rivers.


Where's paradise?...............AoM is....In war there're only loosers!
Paradise is in your heart - ..gonna come! Love is the soul's blood!
open your heart and you'll be in paradise!..There's no uncertainty, there's only hope!
What's the difference between a raven?...What's yellow and hangs in a tree?
Nothing...its legs are both equal, all about the right one!...=> A blue couch!
Real may say he leaves...but be sure, he'll come back!
Bernardo
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 11:02 AM EDT (US)     6 / 34       
But they were beautiful as big ships, and what about the aspect in which they said if you garrisoned archers inside the ship it would shot arrows, if you garrisoned infantry faster, etc.

And I think a big population limit would be great since you can build larger armies, and larger economies.

Kaziglu Bey
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 11:17 AM EDT (US)     7 / 34       
And larger armies are better because...? Bigger armies does not automatically make a game better in my book. Instead I can see a few factors pointing towards the contrary, that larger armies without specific balancing put into the mix can make a game less good.

The early experimenting with the huge ships didn't work out in the end. Ships just got too big to handle. I'm not sure if I've read about confirmed changes to the idea of having units effect the weaponry of a ship, but it feels like a tough task to balance. They can't just throw in features because they seem way cool the first time. I still hope they've done something that discourages battles between slow moving hoards of galleons like how AoK water warfare oftenly degrades too. Manouevering and tactics should ideally be credited above simple massing of vessels.

[This message has been edited by Kaziglu Bey (edited 04-03-2002 @ 11:28 AM).]

Real
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 11:18 AM EDT (US)     8 / 34       
Well, I'm almost positive there'll be a higher pop limit, also 'cause of the settlements.

And the thing with archers on ships - I think it was never confirmed by ES, I think it just was a rumour of crazy fans.And idea probably, other heart it and thought it's confirmed by ES.

And the big ships... yeah, I also loved them and was very sad hearing they aren't in anymore...but it's really better, two ships would be enough to block a river then, and this wouldn't be fun.


Where's paradise?...............AoM is....In war there're only loosers!
Paradise is in your heart - ..gonna come! Love is the soul's blood!
open your heart and you'll be in paradise!..There's no uncertainty, there's only hope!
What's the difference between a raven?...What's yellow and hangs in a tree?
Nothing...its legs are both equal, all about the right one!...=> A blue couch!
Real may say he leaves...but be sure, he'll come back!
Bernardo
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 11:47 AM EDT (US)     9 / 34       
Larger armies are the beauty when going on battle. It's fun (for me) when using the largest army as possible.

And yes maybe it's sure AoM will feature the biggest population limit of all Age series games.

Cyclops
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 11:50 AM EDT (US)     10 / 34       
I love to see a full out HELL in War. It would be sweet to see an army of 200 men destroy a large city.

*drools while waiting for AOM*


Whoever reads what I said above should disregard whatever I said, because I probably don't know what im talking about.
Bernardo
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 12:01 PM EDT (US)     11 / 34       
Yes you could block a river even with a single ship, but they were so beautifully detailed and so realistic, well, ships are not all in game, if they are oing to be small and ugly, I have the option to use them when I want.
Real
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 01:20 PM EDT (US)     12 / 34       
Look at the screenshot with the dragon, look at the ship there, it's little, yes, but it's sooooo detailed, I love it, you'll do so too!

Where's paradise?...............AoM is....In war there're only loosers!
Paradise is in your heart - ..gonna come! Love is the soul's blood!
open your heart and you'll be in paradise!..There's no uncertainty, there's only hope!
What's the difference between a raven?...What's yellow and hangs in a tree?
Nothing...its legs are both equal, all about the right one!...=> A blue couch!
Real may say he leaves...but be sure, he'll come back!
petard_rusher
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 01:34 PM EDT (US)     13 / 34       

Quote:

I love to see a full out HELL in War. It would be sweet to see an army of 200 men destroy a large city.

Unfortunatly to be able to see that you woul ahve to turn the graphics way down, or run it at like 1 FPS, either way it would look stupid.

Real
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 01:42 PM EDT (US)     14 / 34       
It's possiblier with 3D I think.

Where's paradise?...............AoM is....In war there're only loosers!
Paradise is in your heart - ..gonna come! Love is the soul's blood!
open your heart and you'll be in paradise!..There's no uncertainty, there's only hope!
What's the difference between a raven?...What's yellow and hangs in a tree?
Nothing...its legs are both equal, all about the right one!...=> A blue couch!
Real may say he leaves...but be sure, he'll come back!
petard_rusher
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 01:50 PM EDT (US)     15 / 34       
3-D lags ALOt more than 2-D, especially if you have the graphics set high.

Example:
-I play AOK at 1024*768, and with about 80 units it lags only slightly
-I play EE as 800*600, with all the graphics option at their lowest, and the game lags bad with only 40 units on screen.

Bernardo
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 03:13 PM EDT (US)     16 / 34       
Real, I love the details of that little ship, it even seems so little it's a bit bigger than AoK, but it's still teal small, well I use ships when I want.

And who minds if you can't see the whole army in AoM- You can zoom and rotate and tilt and those thingies- we can amass those units and well, in AOK I play using 800X600, And I can see more than 200 units at time.

XCrash_Fish
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 06:02 PM EDT (US)     17 / 34       
In EE, the ships in the modern ages are gigantic (six battleships take up a screen). They are very difficult to select at cetain times. as they are too big to group.

Though I than He - may longer live
He longer must - than I -
For I have but the power to kill,
Without--the power to die--
The only reoccurence in every AoM games you lose, is you.
Socrates
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 06:57 PM EDT (US)     18 / 34       

Quote:

But they were beautiful as big ships, and what about the aspect in which they said if you garrisoned archers inside the ship it would shot arrows, if you garrisoned infantry faster, etc.

And I think a big population limit would be great since you can build larger armies, and larger economies.

Yes you could block a river even with a single ship, but they were so beautifully detailed and so realistic, well, ships are not all in game, if they are oing to be small and ugly, I have the option to use them when I want.

Again, you're not listening. These things sound cool cool on paper, but in the game they're just not practical, or are unfun. If these things have been cut, it'll be for good reason.

Bernardo
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 08:10 PM EDT (US)     19 / 34       
Socrates, can't I give my point of view?

I know why there were cut off but I liked them big, I know is extremely unfun and upractical but's still beautiful.

Well, then what about the aspect you could change ship's fuction by garrisoning different units? Is that unfun too?

robdude11
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 08:14 PM EDT (US)     20 / 34       

Quote:

I know is extremely unfun and upractical but's still beautiful.

this is where u draw the line between graphics/eye candy and gameplay

*draws line*
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[This message has been edited by robdude11 (edited 04-03-2002 @ 08:15 PM).]

Bernardo
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 08:30 PM EDT (US)     21 / 34       
Yes big ships are excellent eyecandies, but what about fuction inluenced by units?
BrazilianRaider
Mortal
posted 03 April 2002 09:39 PM EDT (US)     22 / 34       
Pop will still work like AoK and AoC - you choose the pop limit at the startup screen. But it might be increased by taking settlements and some reliks. it shouldn't be like 100 more pop per settlement, more like 10 or 5.
XCrash_Fish
Mortal
posted 04 April 2002 00:05 AM EDT (US)     23 / 34       
If you dont lie tiny ships, use the editor and make them bigger... or smaller if you so fancy.

Though I than He - may longer live
He longer must - than I -
For I have but the power to kill,
Without--the power to die--
The only reoccurence in every AoM games you lose, is you.
Bernardo
Mortal
posted 04 April 2002 00:08 AM EDT (US)     24 / 34       
Can you do that in editor?! I don't think so.....
Socrates
Mortal
posted 04 April 2002 03:21 AM EDT (US)     25 / 34       

Quote:

Socrates, can't I give my point of view?

Feel free, but I'll be there proving it wrong if I don't agree with it.

Quote:

I know is extremely unfun and upractical but's still beautiful.

If that's your stance, then I'd tend to agree with you - I was adressing your previous views in my comments.


Image of the day:

"There is no greater joy than soaring high on the wings of your dreams, except maybe the joy of watching a dreamer who has nowhere to land but the ocean of reality."
Questionaire
Mortal
posted 04 April 2002 05:45 AM EDT (US)     26 / 34       
Realisticaly Big ships couldn't pass through streams anywhy,
So BIG SHIPS should be in, as well as small raiding ships for passing through streams.

This will work for balance since eggy would be great at this. (Nile)

This would make GREAT stratergy



Im' Here & there & everywhere...

[This message has been edited by Captain_Aneurism (edited 13-13-1645 @ 00:88 RZ)]
[This message has been edited by No one in particular (edited 19-19-3152@ 25:61 MP)]
[This message has been edited by a bored invidual (edited 00-00-566 BC @ 11:11 LX)]
Real
Mortal
posted 04 April 2002 07:31 AM EDT (US)     27 / 34       
Nah, I think there'll only be little ones.

I hope in the editor are maybe the big ones, because in scnzs you don't gotta care ´bout gameplay, only about eyecandy (often though) and there they'll be fantastic!


Where's paradise?...............AoM is....In war there're only loosers!
Paradise is in your heart - ..gonna come! Love is the soul's blood!
open your heart and you'll be in paradise!..There's no uncertainty, there's only hope!
What's the difference between a raven?...What's yellow and hangs in a tree?
Nothing...its legs are both equal, all about the right one!...=> A blue couch!
Real may say he leaves...but be sure, he'll come back!
Bernardo
Mortal
posted 04 April 2002 12:49 PM EDT (US)     28 / 34       
I think you can't do that in the scenario editor (Could be excellent), but well big ships are beautiful, realistic, and if you're playing in a big map, with plenty of water, and with plenty of space even fun, but as the game is it would be really unpractical, unfun and even could make you loose a game... (If you can see almost anything because of the ship...).

Well, I'll use that horrible practical ships when I want.

But then here's a question for ES:

[B]Well, you made little ships, I know why, but what about the aspect in which units you garrisoned in the ships could influence function, why did you cut off that?

XCrash_Fish
Mortal
posted 04 April 2002 05:05 PM EDT (US)     29 / 34       
I dont know about AOM but in EE you can do that... You can make dwarves bigger than Giants. and you can make Giants smaller than dwarves... doesnt do anything but make them bigger/smaller. I like the feature a lot, it gives more variation in projects. One great use is downsizing animals as targets for lightning bolts or other calamities. You cant see it because it is so tiny, but you can make some great special effects!

Though I than He - may longer live
He longer must - than I -
For I have but the power to kill,
Without--the power to die--
The only reoccurence in every AoM games you lose, is you.
ES_DeathShrimp
Immortal
posted 04 April 2002 05:12 PM EDT (US)     30 / 34       

Quote:

Question #1: Why did you make ships samller than they were originally?

DS: They couldn't fit on most maps without devoting a huge chunk of the map to open water. They couldn't go up rivers without making the rivers ridiculously wide.

Quote:

Question #2: Why did you abandoned the idea of making units influential to ship's function?

DS: It made you spend a lot of time loading and unloading ships and would have required a lot of extra UI to develop to show you and other players what units were contributing to the ship. It's still a nifty idea, but with so much to focus on in AOM we wanted to make sure the best ideas got the most attention.

Quote:

Question #3: Will the population limit be larger than the one of AoK?

DS: Population works pretty differently than it did in AOK, which could often devolve into a race to the most Villagers and most soldiers. If you're asking if you can get armies of 100+ units, the answer is yes, though it doesn't happen in all of our games. In general, we have found that players don't use or need as many Villagers to power their economies as in AOK, so they can spend more population on soldiers. Now some players like to have such ludicrously huge pop caps that they have no constraints on either soldiers or Villagers, but allocating limited resources is at the heart of a strategy game. If you want unlimited resources, well heck, you might as well have free units too.

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