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Age of Mythology Heaven » Forums » Strategy and General Discussion » Why limit the number of houses you can build?
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Topic Subject:Why limit the number of houses you can build?
MurphGuitar
Mortal
(id: Sir William of Pork)
posted 14 May 2002 06:05 PM EDT (US)         
In AOK, when I have a nice wood stockpile, I like to build extra houses over the 200 pop cap, even all over the map, so that if my base starts to get destroyed along with all the houses my pop cap isn't affected right away. Why in the world would AoM limit that? Just set a pop cap, and if you have houses way over that, they don't count. There's no reason to disallow that. It could still be separate from settlements' effect on the pop cap.

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AuthorReplies:
TheShadowDawn
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 06:18 PM EDT (US)     1 / 29       
Beats me. Maybe it's saying that like AoK there's a pop cap or something. I don't see why there'd be any limit to how many houses you build.

TheShædøwDåwn
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Yamato
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 06:36 PM EDT (US)     2 / 29       
I wonder if ES did this...

A. because it makes sense in real-life terms to have to defend the houses you actually use if you want to support your population.
-or-
B. to make settlements more important.
-or-
C. because in terms of gameplay they thought it was important to defend your houses rather than use them as forward-building scouting structures.

Probably B is the main reason but it the idea might also have been spawned due to a combination of A and C.


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Kaziglu Bey
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 06:46 PM EDT (US)     3 / 29       
I see two things good in the limit.
a) It's a simple way to impose the limit on pop gain from houses, and simple ways are less prone to bug out.
b) Now houses are finally worth attacking, and therefor worth defending.

Perhaps they can still change it, but I don't think they should.

Zlaz
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 07:12 PM EDT (US)     4 / 29       
Just speculation, but maybe they have no actual pop limit and if there was a civ like the huns with no houses needed (which would be a completely unfair civ in this situation) they would be able to build as many units as they liked, but now they are limiting it by using houses and towncenter population amounts as the amount you can build. So they limit it by a fixed number of houses.

I dont know if this makes sense to anyone or if it even matters. Not saying this is a good or bad idea either. I didnt often build more houses than I needed.

Thunder
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posted 14 May 2002 08:04 PM EDT (US)     5 / 29       
Zlaz is on the right track...I think.

Your population is limited only by the number of houses and settlements you have. There is no fixed population number that applies to all players like in AOK.

[This message has been edited by Thunder (edited 05-14-2002 @ 08:07 PM).]

vladimir87
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 08:12 PM EDT (US)     6 / 29       
Ah, is this the way it was when you "tested" the game?

It seems like a very good idea to me. In AOM and AOE usually houses were teh defign measure anyway until 200... What I mean is that, your population limit would be 4 out of five in the dark age, instead of measuring out of 200... This 200 limit basically was the maximum number of houses you can build, except they allowed you to waste resources by building more...

Now population sort of is more like a resource, with houses granting you more in such a stockpile...

Basically its the same principle, except settlements allow you to build more houses, and you just aren't allowed to build any more houses at a certain point...

I hope I made sense

-Vladimir87

c r e e z y
Mortal
(id: Hairy Scary Man)
posted 14 May 2002 08:30 PM EDT (US)     7 / 29       
a house limit makes denfendin them more important and settlements more important

Imperialarc
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 08:45 PM EDT (US)     8 / 29       
Ah, so that is probably how it works then Thunder? If so then I am glad. Houses will be structures to actually defend. IMO, that is how it should be.
CC_Straight_Og
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 09:29 PM EDT (US)     9 / 29       

Quote:

like to build extra houses over the 200 pop cap, even all over the map, so that if my base starts to get destroyed along with all the houses my pop cap isn't affected right away

So you can't do this. If you let your building get destroyed then you should get housed.

fhertlein
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 09:51 PM EDT (US)     10 / 29       
Perhaps the number of houses allowed is in direct correlation with the population limit.

I can not remember if it was Gamespot or Computer Games magazine that mentioned the ability to set the number of settlements. Perhaps if the settlements per player is 5 then houses are worth 10, 6 settlements houses = 15, etc.

I am very much in favor of limiting the houses for another reason: houses will not be used as walls!!!


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Stone Minotaur
Mortal
posted 14 May 2002 10:26 PM EDT (US)     11 / 29       
man, u do NOT want me to get the chance to wall up in AOK...I put up a stone wall, with palisdide on the outside and in and towers, each with a palisdide or stone wall around it. Once u get past those theres a big line of houses, heheheheehe especially when I go Byzantine, I basically make a reconstruction of Byzantiums double wall Call me mister annoying turtler

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Questionaire
Mortal
posted 15 May 2002 07:43 AM EDT (US)     12 / 29       
Do fortresses (AOK castle equivalents give you more pop slots?) if so:
1. Cause popslot giving house are limited,
2. Wouldn't Forts be too?
3. Huh?


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[This message has been edited by Captain_Aneurism (edited 13-13-1645 @ 00:88 RZ)]
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jefflam
Mortal
posted 15 May 2002 08:16 AM EDT (US)     13 / 29       
Maybe you could only build 1 fort. Maybe it will give you 10 pop. Maybe...

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Yamato
Mortal
posted 15 May 2002 01:00 PM EDT (US)     14 / 29       
So I have two questions:

1. Will the limit on the number of houses be something you can set in game setup

2. Will there be something in the UI which shows you how many houses you have built and how many more you can build? I think they should because sometimes when fighting is going on you won't always know how many settlements/houses you have just off the top of your head. And it would be important to know... "Oh gee I have 19 of a max 20 houses built and many of them are unprotected... I should delete a few of them and rebuild in more defendable locations!"


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Thunder
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posted 15 May 2002 02:19 PM EDT (US)     15 / 29       
1) I dunno

2) That's brilliant...I'd like to see house info like that.

LongSiege
Mortal
posted 15 May 2002 04:12 PM EDT (US)     16 / 29       
Town layout will definitely play a more important role in AoM....

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The_Avenger772
Mortal
posted 16 May 2002 02:57 AM EDT (US)     17 / 29       
just like pop limit in AoK, AoM could have a little slot saying 19/20 with a house image next to it. AoM interface is already cluttered... now we get MORE stuff *sigh*
Thunder
VIP BonusXP
posted 16 May 2002 03:22 AM EDT (US)     18 / 29       
I would never use the word "Cluttered" to describe the UI in AOM. It's laid out really well and offers lots of information at a glance. (such as if you have idle villes...you can tell about how many instantly)
Dagobert
Mortal
posted 16 May 2002 08:14 AM EDT (US)     19 / 29       
All Poseidon players, stand up and PROTEST!!

You will not be able to uses rows of houses as walls to keep a hidden army of militia waiting the destruction of the houses to get into action...

Sad! Sad! Sad!


************
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Cataphract887
Mortal
posted 16 May 2002 09:14 AM EDT (US)     20 / 29       
ok,ive been ''out of the loop'' as some people say it,and am wondering where you guys got this?
jefflam
Mortal
posted 16 May 2002 09:50 AM EDT (US)     21 / 29       
Maybe thats because of the Poseidon militia adding that's why they have a limit..
But then wouldn't they have to have a limit on barracks, stables, etc?
I'm talking nonsense again..

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Yamato
Mortal
posted 16 May 2002 03:26 PM EDT (US)     22 / 29       
Cataphract... from the AOM main page...

While answering fan questions at Jeux Strategie, Sandy "Sandyman" Petersen revealed an interesting new fact about houses in AOM. Yes, they add to your population limit just like in AOK and AOE, but:
"Q. what will be the house fonction ?
A. Houses give you extra population, just like in AoK. There is a limit to how many houses you can construct." - Sandy Petersen


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The_Avenger772
Mortal
posted 17 May 2002 03:00 AM EDT (US)     23 / 29       
yes, jefflam, nonsense. They might as well limit everything you do so every game goes exactly the same.

if they limited houses forts will be:

-not count to pop limit
-are limited too
-after the first selected no. of forts more forts don't contribute to pop cap

DARK_JOAO
Mortal
posted 17 May 2002 04:43 AM EDT (US)     24 / 29       
Maybe they dont want people to make walls en get los building houses, maybe they prefer real walls and outposts.
jefflam
Mortal
posted 17 May 2002 05:02 AM EDT (US)     25 / 29       
I think the real reason is to make houses more important to defend. Its the most logical reason.

As for to make settlements more important, well maybe. But I think thats to prevent people from turtling up to often.

Turtle = less pop = less unit
Expand and get settlements = more pop = more units = most likely to win.


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Anger leads to hate.
Hate leads to suffering.
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ES_DeathShrimp
Immortal
posted 17 May 2002 11:07 AM EDT (US)     26 / 29       

Quote:

A. because it makes sense in real-life terms to have to defend the houses you actually use if you want to support your population.
-or-
B. to make settlements more important.
-or-
C. because in terms of gameplay they thought it was important to defend your houses rather than use them as forward-building scouting structures.

DS: Those are all valid reasons. Here are a few more.

D. It's dumb to use Houses as defensive structures.
E. Making spare Houses in case your "real" ones get attacked makes the game drag on. RTS games are supposed to be about allocation of resources--if you can build as many Houses as you want, you're not really limited in one of the resources.
F. Attacking Houses now becomes a valid strategy, along with attacking an army, Villagers, TCs or unit-producing buildings.

And most importantly...

G. It is probably less confusing (especially for new players) to be stopped from building additional Houses rather than keep building Houses that don't actually contribute to their population.

WhoAskedU
Mortal
posted 17 May 2002 11:13 AM EDT (US)     27 / 29       
Or

H. what i was thinking is having excess houses would take up RAM space, and why More houses then actually needed at the sacrafice of RAM? and a slow down of YOUR computer? now for some people the use of this RAM is no problem...but to others this can be a MAJOR problem...


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Kong_KK
Mortal
posted 18 May 2002 10:58 AM EDT (US)     28 / 29       
Uhh...errr...I don't think ram would really be a problem with that. I'm guessing ES makes good use of resources so every house you build doesn't take up another mb of ram.

Unless...

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who_da_man12
Mortal
posted 18 May 2002 11:42 AM EDT (US)     29 / 29       
sorry for this off topic, but WhoAskedU,how do u make that more than 6 lines sig?i can only do 6 lines!!!!ahhhhhhhhh

anyways, on the houses, i was hoping that your pop limit depends on how many huses u got, like the more houses the more pop u can get, no real limitation, maybe there could be an empire size-to pop relation, depending on how big ur empire expands the more ppl u can get, the more houses u can build?thatdbe very ideal!!id love it since i hate the pop limit in aok, usually 3/4 of my pop in aok is traders and villls and that geets me mad since then there is no more room for military.


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