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Age of Mythology Heaven » Forums » Scenario Design » The New Interface
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Topic Subject:The New Interface
Shiva
HG Alumnus
posted 13 September 2002 04:11 PM EDT (US)         
Any of you guys think the New Interface will affect the number of people who design for AoM? One of the main reasons I left EE was that it took a lot of time for me to do anything with it. And the interface was extremely annoying, having to go from one window to the other to create a new effect, or select a guy to increase his HP.

There were also many, many things that i could add which is good, but they left little place for perfection (which, IMO every designer should strive for).

In AoK, that wasn't the case. The interface was small, efficient..and there weren't massive amount of things i could put in 1 city.

Will AoM change this? What are your thoughts?

Shiva

AuthorReplies:
Matei
Mortal
posted 13 September 2002 05:01 PM EDT (US)     1 / 20       
Hmm the screenshots don't show much so we can't tell for sure. I hope that (1) there's quick and easy to use interface for everything and (2) it has the power to do advanced things like the EE interface.

Programmer on 0 A.D., author of Norse Wars, co-author of Fort Wars.
Sunshine
Banned
posted 13 September 2002 05:02 PM EDT (US)     2 / 20       
From what I have heard, AoM's Scenario Interface will be easier to use, but also allow you to do more. For example, I found AoK's editor alright, but it had lots of potential in being better. I am hoping AoM's scenario editor will possibly be better then AoK's editor, and maybe become one of the best scenario editors for an RTS game as such. I am looking very forward to AoM's editor as most people are...

Nice topic, by the way, Shiva.

Intrepid
Mortal
posted 13 September 2002 07:21 PM EDT (US)     3 / 20       
I am hoping that this editor will build upon the concepts in Empire Earth editor instead of the Age of Kings editor. The Empire Earth editor is probably the one of the most powerful, if not the most powerful, editor out there. Although the Empire Earth editor was daunting for some to learn it would allow you to complete complex trigger systems at a much greater rate than the Age of Kings editor and with far less error. That is of course once you got the hang of it and understood all of the fundamentals behind it.

As for the interface, I rather liked it in Empire Earth. It was simple while at the same time giving you the options needed to accomplish things with speed and efficiency.

I found the Age of Kings editor, now that I look back at it, to be extremely inefficient. It took forever to make triggers, there was a always a greater percentage of error than with the Empire Earth editor and you always had to recreate effects and conditions for every trigger.

If the AoM editor uses the same trigger system as the AoK editor did I do not think I would have the patience to use it.

Shiva
HG Alumnus
posted 14 September 2002 08:54 AM EDT (US)     4 / 20       
Our thoughts differ completely intrepid!

I'd hate the AoM editor if it was anything like EE's..

It was the simplicity of the AoK's editor that i liked. Sure, the lack of some key things made it a little "$#%^#$" but it was the same lack that helped many rookies get better in the editor.


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Intrepid
Mortal
posted 14 September 2002 11:24 AM EDT (US)     5 / 20       
I would not be adverse to a completely new design that is revolutionary as long at it met some of my requirements in an editor. Which are basically that it has ease of use, minimizes mistakes and allows for the design of complex trigger arrangements.
Shiva
HG Alumnus
posted 14 September 2002 04:32 PM EDT (US)     6 / 20       
ditto. And the EE Editor had none of that.

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Intrepid
Mortal
posted 14 September 2002 06:01 PM EDT (US)     7 / 20       
CheeZy_monkey0
Mortal
posted 14 September 2002 11:45 PM EDT (US)     8 / 20       
I liked the EE editor, especially the camera control, you just hold the "`" button on your keyboard and move the mouse around. This concept seems to be different in AOM.

Otherwise the premature interface of AOM looks saxy and easy to use. I am suspecting that you can work with multiple windows, i.e. you have a terrain window up and you're also browsing through the units window.

The AOM triggers are going to be similar to the EE ones (but easier i think), i am dead positive that theres graphic scale and graphic effect triggers in the scenario editor (look at the christmas screenies for proof)

I'd have to agree with intrepred that the EE scenario is very powerful and i mutch prefer it over AOK's. It was very powerful.

The only thing i hated about it is that theres NO HOTKEYS, you can't use the mousewheel to scroll, if you press B it won't jump you to the barracks on the unit page etc etc, it was very anoying and made things take forever to do.

The only worthwhile hotkey feature is the elevation.
Few people know this but,

When you're placing terrain, hold down the right mouse button and move the mouse up or down, the tile that the pointer is up will now increase and decrease in elevation acourding to which dirrection you move the mouse, this was very handy for making good hills, and you didn't have to go back and forth to the elevation screen to select which elevation size you want.

Also if you hold down the right and then the left mouse button and move the mouse around, you will be able to level terrain; the tile of terrain that the pointer was over will be "stretched" and level the other terrain to be evan with the terrain the mouse pointer is over.

These were very handy tricks but since the AOM elevation placement thing is very very different from any other game, i don't know if this will be possible to recreate in AOM.

In AOM you can make actual slope elevation. If you don't know what i'm talking about, picture a U cut in half, you can make slopes like that, and you still have the classic diagnal slope but you can position it in 180 degrees of slope, so you can have a tile facing straight up, you can have one go sideways, you can make a steep steep hill or a shallow little lump of elevation on the ground

Yehoshua Yisrael
Mortal
posted 15 September 2002 01:51 AM EDT (US)     9 / 20       
If some of you have had experience with the Star Wars: Galactic Battlegrounds editor, you might find that it is basically a carbon copy of the AOK editor, but ten times better in that aspect.

(Just recently I opened up the old AOK editor and took a look. Grief, the similarities were just triggers and that was it.)

I am looking forward to the AOM editor. If it is as good as they say, I can focus more on the story and the system of fighting rather than worry about how the map looks and whether I should worry about naming fifty or so soldiers.

I have never had trouble with triggers, or shall we say, in the past few months I have never had trouble with the editor. AOK to me was the most confusing editor existing, but once I got used to it, I could never figure out why I had so much trouble understanding it.

With the beautify option available for map designing, it won't be as hard to create beautiful maps and sprawling cities and towns. This is the only consolation that the n00b maps will look nice .

I am completely excited about the prospect of designing for this game if not playing it. I look forward to creating epic scenarios with it and making friends among the scenario design community .

- Yehoshua Yisrael


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Shiva
HG Alumnus
posted 15 September 2002 10:31 AM EDT (US)     10 / 20       
and that..closes this topic.

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Night Conqueror
Mortal
posted 15 September 2002 11:49 AM EDT (US)     11 / 20       
Yes, very well put Yehoshua

Night Conqueror
Gawain
Mortal
posted 16 September 2002 11:43 AM EDT (US)     12 / 20       
It's kind of weird how everyone who liked EE's editor disliked AoK's, and vice versa.

I hated EE's editor, but loved AoK's editor. WC3 had an ok editor, but I never got into it enough to make a fair evaluation.

From the pic of AoM's editor, it looks like it might similar to WC3's, but that was only one screenshot.


USMC
CheeZy_monkey0
Mortal
posted 16 September 2002 01:09 PM EDT (US)     13 / 20       
Actually I like both scenario editors, and for a long time i thought the AOK editor was easier than EE's
After i got abit expirianced I saw the other way around
Rasher
HG Alumnus
(id: Angel Rasher)
posted 16 September 2002 02:05 PM EDT (US)     14 / 20       

Quote:

It's kind of weird how everyone who liked EE's editor disliked AoK's, and vice versa.


Not at all... for it's time, AoK had the most powerful editor. EE's editor was definately better, but it also came about later. I designed for both games, and while I prefer the Empire Earth editor, Age of King's editor was a great tool as well.

The Rasher
rasher@accesswave.com
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David
HG Alumnus
posted 16 September 2002 02:15 PM EDT (US)     15 / 20       
Archy just posted a screenshot of the trigger editor...time to get speculating.
Gawain
Mortal
posted 16 September 2002 03:23 PM EDT (US)     16 / 20       
AoM's trigger editor looks more similar to AoK's than EE's. I am relieved to see that it does not have EE's disjointed layout.

There is no question about the power of EE's editor, but the layout compared to AoK was completely different. For me, being able to fluidly and rapidly create triggers in AoK's editor was way more appealing than having to go through four tabs just to task a soldier somewhere.

And the bugs didn't help either..


USMC
zam zap
Mortal
posted 16 September 2002 03:39 PM EDT (US)     17 / 20       
ee's editor is based off of the aok editor so if you look at a base point they share some parts but i perfer the EE editor because of the camera and more options.

ZAM WILL ZAPATH!!

Shiva
HG Alumnus
posted 16 September 2002 03:54 PM EDT (US)     18 / 20       
Another reason for my disliking EE's (and Sw:GB's) editor..is that they're merely modified from AoK.

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Intrepid
Mortal
posted 16 September 2002 05:49 PM EDT (US)     19 / 20       
I do not hate the Age of Kings editor or anything; I used it to bring my creations to life for over 2 years. Also it was the first editor I had ever used that had a trigger system. It is just that going from the Age of Kings editor to the Empire Earth editor is like being promoted from training wheels to rocket ship. Once you are piloting the rocket ship you never want to go back to the training wheels.
Tevious
Mortal
(id: The Vampire Slayer)
posted 16 September 2002 06:10 PM EDT (US)     20 / 20       

Quote:

Another reason for my disliking EE's (and Sw:GB's) editor..is that they're merely modified from AoK.

The SWGB editor IS the AoK editor... it just has a few more triggers and different objects in the "Units" section. I don't see how you can dislike it any more than the AoK editor.


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