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Age of Mythology Heaven » Forums » Strategy Discussion » POLL: Do RC need to be ADJUSTED? experts only 1900+
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Topic Subject:POLL: Do RC need to be ADJUSTED? experts only 1900+
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oljb007
Mortal
posted 13 August 2003 05:48 PM EDT (US)         
just curious to see the divide among experts. not necessarily nerfed just changed. please just say yes or no so counting is easier!


Titans oljb007
Vanilla oljb007 (1684)

"am i a smurf if i beat you? Well, you are if you beat me" --isnt that the general idea of this game?

AuthorReplies:
IX_Chimera
Mortal
posted 13 August 2003 05:51 PM EDT (US)     1 / 29       
no
The Jackal
Mortal
posted 13 August 2003 06:52 PM EDT (US)     2 / 29       
no
KataklysM
Mortal
posted 13 August 2003 09:13 PM EDT (US)     3 / 29       
maybe u shoulda put the rating down.
Nobody's posting.
As I am not 1900+, I can't post.
Also, there's already many threads about this.
BsK_RagnaroK
Mortal
posted 13 August 2003 10:08 PM EDT (US)     4 / 29       
How do you know the people who reply to this topic are 1900+ or not?

Hohoho.
futurehermit
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 00:47 AM EDT (US)     5 / 29       
yeah, and make sure you ask them if they play greek or not (honestly). why would a norse rc spammer vote yes???

and ask their response to this: is it fair that regular rc beat medium hippikons pop/cost?

fh

IX_Chimera
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 00:58 AM EDT (US)     6 / 29       
no

now my question... is it fair that greek can own norse inmythic? is it fair that set owns norse so bad cos they dont get pierce units? is it fair that our hunters can be made useless just by killing an ox cart? is it fair that norse dont have a decent anti cav unit? is it fair that norse building go down like flys?is it fair that norse need soldiers to build do if you are destroying his military buildings he has nothing left? are these fair? one ****ing complaint and its all over the boards just learn to deal with it

futurehermit
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 01:05 AM EDT (US)     7 / 29       
now my question... is it fair that greek can own norse inmythic?

--no, it's not. i have no problem with beefing norse slightly in mythic and have said that elsewhere.

is it fair that set owns norse so bad cos they dont get pierce units?

--no, everyone knows set is op

is it fair that our hunters can be made useless just by killing an ox cart?

--yes, you could just as easily kill a greek resource dump sight. ox carts can be moved for maximum efficiency so the trade-off is fair.

is it fair that norse dont have a decent anti cav unit?

--they do, bragi-ulfs. or forseti ulfs in classical. ulfs die to hard to their counters? i've said elsewhere that ulfs could be given 5% more pierce because they're too weak in that area.

is it fair that norse building go down like flys?

--yes, because they go up very fast and cost much less. that is the trade-off. conversely, eggy buildings take a very long time to build but once up are very hard to take down.

is it fair that norse need soldiers to build do if you are destroying his military buildings he has nothing left?

--yes, norse don't require their resource-collectors to build, which is an economic bonus. that is how norse were set-up to play and is a big part of the reason why norse are so dominant on water.

are these fair?

--some yes some no, see above.

one ****ing complaint and its all over the boards just learn to deal with it

--so what u're saying is stop playing greek and play thor/set/isis like everyone else. great! thanks for the tips!

fh

Lokipower
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 04:06 AM EDT (US)     8 / 29       
i'm a 1800+ Poseidon and I say RC are fine. I've never had problems vs massed RC. Especially with the hoplite food reduction, you only need a few hops to scare them off fairly easily... Hades' mass toxotes own mass RC pretty badly too. At the very best, perhaps a SLIGHT hack armor reduction but other than that theyre fine.
Lokipower
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 04:08 AM EDT (US)     9 / 29       
so that would be a

no

IX_Chimera
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 05:46 AM EDT (US)     10 / 29       
no what im saying is deal with it....

do a strat that beats it simmple and actually you take down an ox cart and run away job done you take down a storehous and run away they build another one in seconds.

and you kinda ****ed yourself over lol you was talking about trade offs etc. thats what the greeks are. they trade the ability to rock in classical for the ability to absolutley demolish everything in mythic/heroic its a trade off you see?

IX_Chimera
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 05:47 AM EDT (US)     11 / 29       
ow btw odin dont get bragi or forseti so wtf he gonna do?
futurehermit
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 09:21 AM EDT (US)     12 / 29       
so what u're saying is that norse should beat greek 1v1 because they are better in classical?

ok great i guess i won't play 1v1 rated anymore.

and, yes, i don't think poseidon has as much trouble vs rc as zeus does because (a) poseidon can go classical faster, (b) his stables and hippikons are cheaper, (c) he can go ares allowing a strong early hippikon rush/raids.

axemen > ulfs in classical.

in heroic, when u see forseti-bragi ulfs u can go skadi axemen.

so, yeah, odin can't just mass jarls in heroic boo hoo.

the whole point here is that 3 rc beat 2 medium hippikons. when someone tells me how this is fair i will stop posting about it.

fh

Fenrir_Achilles
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 09:23 AM EDT (US)     13 / 29       
Hermit RC are fine! get over it!

PS. GG last night i slaughtered your food guys

IX_Chimera
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 11:01 AM EDT (US)     14 / 29       
who masses jarls these days? no one who does pure rc? no one you always need a mix or your gonna die simple theres notone unit in game that can beat counters massed.

try to make maybe 15 hoplites and get tower upgrade sit defend maybe make 5 or 6 hipps to raid and distract the enemy then hit heroic and go prod/ tox and destroy everything norse can throw at you. or theres other ways around it... last night and today i have been trying out some strats for greek on eso vs norse massed rc and i can see theres a problem but there are ways aroound it.

start thinking instead of moaning abd acting like some newb who crys cos his favourite unit loses

oljb007
Mortal
posted 14 August 2003 11:44 AM EDT (US)     15 / 29       
ok, this thread did go the way i had hoped.


Titans oljb007
Vanilla oljb007 (1684)

"am i a smurf if i beat you? Well, you are if you beat me" --isnt that the general idea of this game?

Lokipower
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 03:49 AM EDT (US)     16 / 29       
If your opponent goes pure RC and you go FH + Prodromos he's pretty much screwed.
Pipalonias
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 04:38 AM EDT (US)     17 / 29       
Err if you can do a fh while he has 15+ rc attacking you, you should be fine... otherwise then that... >


And Chimera, you are majorly biased with the norse.... try taking it from a greek/egyptian point of view.

[This message has been edited by Pipalonias (edited 08-15-2003 @ 04:50 AM).]

DarkDalamar
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 05:34 AM EDT (US)     18 / 29       
I think rc doesnt really need a nerf because vs greek greek's toxotes counter 2 of our units during classical + our hero sux a lot......

Only change rc might have is to lower its hack armor by 5% but i dont think that is as necessary as set's nerf...

BTW in classical fighting good greek players usually can beat norse the only thing we can do is to run our rc around and hope not to get caught... Because in classic greek already gets the strong hippie + tox combo which costs less food and lets the greek player go heroic early... hoplite tox combo owns rc but cant catch them... As a pose player said hoplites scare us easily too :P

Rc does beat all hippokon because of its speed and can fight vs hippies... This really does affect poseidon vs odin but in heroic poseidon can beat odin easily

BTW there is the fact that norse doesnt have any pierce damage...........

In the end i would say the hack armor can be reduced by 5% but they definately need to give something to rc in that case which would be pierce armor... But would u guys like rc that dont care about tower and tc fire while raiding...??? they could also give boost vs ta in that case to rc... Just leave them as they r lol


L_Clan_Dalamar, eso nicks: glhfgggb, L_clan_dalamar
petero
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 05:36 AM EDT (US)     19 / 29       
"please just say yes or no so counting is easier!"

i think some people in here have trouble reading a simple sentence
anybody need glasses????


(ESO name: Renshai)
Bazz Lightyear
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 05:45 AM EDT (US)     20 / 29       
oh man... the fact that it may work the way it is now doesn't mean it's the right way. cause what does a norse player make when a geek player makes hipp's?? rc and not ulf like he actually should and rc beats all his eggy counters 1v1.

so just to make it more the way it was meant to be, we need to reduce hack armor for rc and raise the ulf pierce a little bit and fix the ta - rc thing. then it'll be fine

Tordenskiold
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 06:22 AM EDT (US)     21 / 29       

Quoted from DarkDalamar:

Because in classic greek already gets the strong hippie + tox combo which costs less food and lets the greek player go heroic early.

This is such a die-hard myth

Norse get RC+TA combo to counter both cost- and pop effectivly and TA does much more damage to hipps than tox's does to RC so in fact the norse should be ahead with this combo.


TORDENSKIOLD(1690-1720)

During the Great Nordic War (1700-1720), he was commander of the danish navy, which defeaded the swedish army at Kristiania (modern Oslo). After the war, he was killed in a duel on Nov. 12, 1720 just outside Hamburg, Germany, during a travel to England.

ESO: TORDENSKIOLD
futurehermit
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 03:22 PM EDT (US)     22 / 29       
"try to make maybe 15 hoplites and get tower upgrade sit defend maybe make 5 or 6 hipps to raid and distract the enemy then hit heroic and go prod/ tox and destroy everything norse can throw at you. or theres other ways around it... last night and today i have been trying out some strats for greek on eso vs norse massed rc and i can see theres a problem but there are ways aroound it."

u can "see theres a problem"...

ok, so u actually looked from the greek perspective! THANKS! wow!

the solution? yes, make two food/gold troops while doing a fh while fending off 16 rc raping ur econ! YES! i'll get right on that!

i'm not saying it's IMPOSSIBLE to beat a norse rc spammer. what i'm saying is that u have to be a better player. fine, but should an = skilled player lose just because of a unit imbalance? NO! that's what started all this stuff in the first place!

BLAH!

i played a member of my clan who's approx. = skill the other day. he went massed rc, forced me on the defensive (yes, i made hop-tox, upgraded towers). then he went heroic first (hops cost more food than rc) and spammed hill forts around my base and jarl-huskarl-rammed me to death. yes, i held off his raids ok, but i surrendered map control.

in this game defensive = dead.

u can't be offensive vs. an = skilled norse player with hippikon raids because their rc catch ur raiding party and beat MEDIUM raiders pop/cost...

ok, so be offensive with hop-tox? well, speaking of upgrading towers, if a norse player towers up with a few taxmen they can beat down this attack while still raping ur econ at home with rc!

like i said. yes, greek can beat norse but must be 50 pts greater in skill because rc > medium hipps pop/cost.

play some more greek on eso 1700+ vs. norse rc spammers and u'll begin to understand what we're frickin saying here.

fh

Fenrir_Achilles
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 04:38 PM EDT (US)     23 / 29       
FH No offense but thta one game u let me rip apart you economy you didnt notice that i was raiding until i killed all of your food guys so you should put this on your self
IX_Chimera
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 04:42 PM EDT (US)     24 / 29       
i was playing at 1700+ level my name was 1800+ might have been 1900 (not sure) it dropped 100 points(cos i dont play greek) i played vs some guys who rc spammed i made 8 hoplites lol only 8 and put them at key points i thought hed raid (as a norse player i know roughtly where hes gonna try) i got tower upgrade (didnt get crennalations towers scare rc as it is) sat defended hit heroic and destroyed him and his FB (i was zeus) his army was totally ineffective vs me he had to heroic himself as prod tox was owning him. by the time he was heroic i was booming out of 2 tcs a nice FB and 3rd tc going up 4th secured for building later. needless to say he lost. its possible at 1700+ so dont tell me it aint. now back to norse for me and hopefully enough of theses silly topics
Glock_Glock
Mortal
posted 15 August 2003 04:57 PM EDT (US)     25 / 29       

Quote:

their rc catch ur raiding party and beat MEDIUM raiders pop/cost...


would you stop saying that
RC do NOT beat hipps cost effectively, only pop effectively
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